From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Authentication-Results: passt.top; dmarc=none (p=none dis=none) header.from=gibson.dropbear.id.au Authentication-Results: passt.top; dkim=pass (2048-bit key; secure) header.d=gibson.dropbear.id.au header.i=@gibson.dropbear.id.au header.a=rsa-sha256 header.s=202508 header.b=dicMGEUJ; dkim-atps=neutral Received: from mail.ozlabs.org (gandalf.ozlabs.org [150.107.74.76]) by passt.top (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0249A5A0279 for ; Thu, 14 Aug 2025 06:57:49 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gibson.dropbear.id.au; s=202508; t=1755147466; bh=gg1gvtLuNZ3TD867mvGMAE0lCAwbZt0m3ZwBFTya3so=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=dicMGEUJZWqmF4RtXSze3JlAHHk7ICdNUXDu9A1uhqwW0zdcq5mevgW5hD4NkBYMj ciGaMScs8LDVs1UaTsptiYJ/h+qJZVBKnpI5vpfBQdOtrqNlAXZ6edcEKdOyi9u00k gomnTq2DLCHZaQNMFw/M0GfpY7iQpd+cLMfRiuPm8tMc1Z50wsc/9JZgL5rI9MHfCL HPnQtJmojx3DWJRY8rV4b29c6H24spibRmbhyBWQE+byYt0hAiHQFkGNqwLbbI39OV lX/GOpSSAVgEW+2FuwYecvPhVrZYua4dkRfTxwp+ol2wPYvuzkU4OnK4Gx4rGrr9qf I5t6H9gN8DwWw== Received: by gandalf.ozlabs.org (Postfix, from userid 1007) id 4c2Xzt0kwmz4x5M; Thu, 14 Aug 2025 14:57:46 +1000 (AEST) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 14:57:43 +1000 From: David Gibson To: Stefano Brivio Subject: Re: Exeter testing, next steps Message-ID: References: <20250805095241.6cb715d5@elisabeth> <20250813200423.69397f77@elisabeth> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="7GGzJaRmaWwGvwzu" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20250813200423.69397f77@elisabeth> Message-ID-Hash: J2EP7S6NDISGCOTNQY4JGIQ6B3WSISM3 X-Message-ID-Hash: J2EP7S6NDISGCOTNQY4JGIQ6B3WSISM3 X-MailFrom: dgibson@gandalf.ozlabs.org X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: passt-dev@passt.top X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.8 Precedence: list List-Id: Development discussion and patches for passt Archived-At: Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --7GGzJaRmaWwGvwzu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Aug 13, 2025 at 08:04:23PM +0200, Stefano Brivio wrote: > On Wed, 6 Aug 2025 11:11:24 +1000 > David Gibson wrote: >=20 > > On Tue, Aug 05, 2025 at 09:52:41AM +0200, Stefano Brivio wrote: > > > > > > > If we can start introducing some exeter tests, the next step would = be > > > > to work on the support library stuff for constructing more complex > > > > network environments from namespaces. I have draft series with this > > > > as well, but I was looking at splitting it into another mini-project > > > > (tentative name "sinte" - Simulated Inter Network Test Environment)= =2E =20 > > >=20 > > > Neat! That sounds like the juicy part and surely one part we really > > > miss at this point. I would go as far as proposing PESTO (playground > > > environment simplifies test orchestration / spurs test opportunities) > > > but "sinte" sounds good to me as well. =20 > >=20 > > I kind of love the "pesto" acronym, but the proposed expansions don't > > quite work for me though: they don't say anything specifically about > > networking, and it's really not about test orchestration - this is > > about how to write a single test. >=20 > I couldn't come up with much better (and didn't get to actually review > the patches) yet, but I just wanted to quickly mention that by > "orchestration" I was referring to juggling namespaces and virtual > machines (at some point...?) with virtual links around, within a single > test. That makes sense, but I don't think that meaning is obvious within the name alone. > And maybe at some point networking could be marginal in the whole thing. Hm. Maybe. At this point handling network environments and specifically *inter* network environments is really my focus though. > > The infuriating thing is I'm pretty sure I came up with a much better > > tentative name months ago, and then forgot it. >=20 > I know you meant it for something else, but I'm wondering if you're > referring to NUDEL perhaps. No, I think I had a tentative name specifically for this network simulation thingy. *brainstorms* One idea I had was "instead" - Inter Network Simulated Test Environment . "with Arbitary Devices" maybe? That might be the one I'm thinking of, but I think I had one I liked better. Had a chat with Gemini and came up with a handful more options: "mimic" - Multi-host Inter-network Mock Infrastructure Construct "isthmus" - Inter-network Simulation & Test Harness for Multiple Underlying Systems "ross" - "Routing & Orchestration Simulation System" Or, maybe.. "tunbridge" - Tunbridge (like Exeter) is a town in Tasmania, and a bridge of tun devices would likely be a common construct to build with it (though not as common as a bridge of veths, admittedly). --=20 David Gibson (he or they) | I'll have my music baroque, and my code david AT gibson.dropbear.id.au | minimalist, thank you, not the other way | around. http://www.ozlabs.org/~dgibson --7GGzJaRmaWwGvwzu Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCgAdFiEEO+dNsU4E3yXUXRK2zQJF27ox2GcFAmidbMcACgkQzQJF27ox 2GdzshAAlvcBq9d6FUb5IJ24AlfCiPkgDGKOsUqsVPvRh9D4UlAu5OuhqIbv3Uwi Bb1aXEgje/mWcNYtPDgfhPoklEF7f0dTuax0sS5Cfb0Vgd6h7W+dWaPr7y8RnhBU xwuJTtaklC9U3H9q9Z3vHNfX69FPPJv110hPtdWStJfIOMnYlYIJ0TNEBbnCbX2A 4VlEtdGkdBTFDxki92y9FXAhPJniqUHnl3IrjlGxeLmQF5SrUVBLgG9zViLU4xk9 FJHXwhevUeXYpV8PCqauD6IenLUOq1BeLSmS3gRs19mgzz+lQd1Cq3IlTY6csZpV DGRmXivSfYtA3K+fimv3xt0MKYvQuII6hXeVffsfFlXbu5x4CyG9xnHB+PWBq6MU 6PC7e4/++qyhcmGsP/9h+F7OwctmUF5A/GjtELjz6RiRkmlknVnmR2W49MWT8lBN O0y8th8Y+Q7VZLUsnZWSsvquSqM3r8XaRIOz5kECvBHJnsuu1RleiyIuLIlvhHtn GWD12M7LcoLFv49H0xyjsZtay83Qj/1tHtqvvyh62FYZ7DKJ0DFjnaThId/Ktw55 Q6sT7fZANVaEU8awQcm0sd+X4Nxm1F+G7TNynqjn7IFdAvqx9BawqIcaORrocGot u/NeLHkKmrPR/nnfUD5BiByjkEuJoVy0COtqI8RMbxI8tc/yAc4= =LQpU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --7GGzJaRmaWwGvwzu--